While I have no answers for the first, I do have an explanation for the second. In-game they suggest that Yalbadoath made a wager with another entity, likely Philemon, for the fate of humanity. This wager was the game between Akechi and the Trickster, two humans given extraordinary power from vastly different backgrounds. Yaldabaoth would win if humanity proved unable to get over their slothliness and willingness to submit, and thus be turned over to Yaldabaoth. Otherwise the other entity would win the bet and Yaldy would have to relinquish their fates to themselves. However, Yaldabaoth made sure to rig the wager, much as Nyarlathotep had in the past, to assure his ultimate victory, even in the case of his champion (Akechi)’s defeat. The original Igor knew all about this and sent Morgana to give the trickster what help he could, in hopes of balancing out this game.

That's actually a really neat explanation. I knew it made sense, but I wasn't given enough clues in just 5. And I've never played Persona before, so I don't know any of the mythos with demons and whatnot. Like, who is Philemon, not that it's too important. I am curious if like Akira, did Akechi have the potential of power or was it all given to him? Was there any reason at all Akechi was chosen as his champion? Something about Akechi is off too, how he's also a Wild Card, yet he only uses two Personas of the same Arcane, both Justice, so was that a coincidence or limitation of power or not even supposed to be an element of the story? Fans uncovered themselves Loki is of Justice, like Robin Hood, but it's never shown in game.

Philemon is an important character, primarily from P1 and P2, though he is believed to make cameos in 3 and 4 as a butterfly, dunno if that’s confirmed. While no answers for wildcards are given in P5, in 1 and 2 everyone had the potential to act as a pseudo-wildcard, once they were awoken to their power. So I think it’s safe to say anyone has the potential for it, and Akira and Akechi were merely chosen as antagonists for each other, similar to Yu and Adachi. As for Loki and Robin Hood, they are both shown to be aspects of Akechi himself, think ultimate and original persona. These are likely the only ones used in-game as they are the only ones that tell you anything about Akechi’s character. Any other Persona a wildcard might use gives you no insight as to their true selves

Thanks for the help. You've got great knowledge of the series! But the butterfly Lavenza used was her and a reference to Philemon or was it Philemon?

Fun fact: I haven’t actually played any of the games, I mostly just use the SMT wiki and some info I overheard from other users like Tatsuya and Yu. This last one’s the subject of debate. Many think it’s Lavenza herself since it’s her voice that speaks to the protag, but since the blue butterfly is Philemon she could just as easily have spoken using magic while Philemon himself appeared. This last one is mostly due to the fact it was Philemon in butterfly form that gave Aigis the wildcard ability in P3P’s The Answer

My question is: Who are the Velvet Siblings? You know, every single assistant of Igor. Who are they, and why do they always change?

You can probably find that on the wiki itself. http://megamitensei.wikia.com/wiki/Velvet_Room You helped me out, BGammax. I read through all the articles I had questions about on the wiki and didn't find any satisfactory answers, yet apparently you managed to arrange the facts better for me, and that was the point of this topic. Thanks!

My question is: Who are the Velvet Siblings? You know, every single assistant of Igor. Who are they, and why do they always change?The Velvet Siblings are odd. Dunno much about their background, but I do know that they weren't around prior to P3. Not sure why they always change, but I do know that Elizabeth left to find a way to free a certain door boy. The others... no idea why they left/changed.

My question is: Who are the Velvet Siblings? You know, every single assistant of Igor. Who are they, and why do they always change? Iirc I believe the attendants were created by Igor to help him with aiding the wild card (and so that he can do nothing and look cool behind the desk). As stated by other people before very little are known about them. The attendants created by Igor we have so far are: Elizabeth, Theodore, Margaret, Lavenza and Morgana. Someone correct me if I missed anyone out.

Well I'm not too knowledgable about Persona as a series as a whole because I've only played 5, but I might have answers for your first question TogoSystem. So as far as to my understanding, the Metaverse we traveled in in the game was Japans own cognition and, as you said, the other countries and areas of the world would have differing cognitions. Think of it like this, the Metaverse is a Galaxy, and each country or location is its own planet, wholly separated from each other yet existing by the same rules that bind them all together. For proof of this, at least to my knowledge, is that during the trip to Hawaii I don't remember ever entering the Metaverse. Now this can be taken two ways plotwise. 1. Is that they would just be relaxing and don't care to enter, which is obviously what they presented, but I like to see it as 2. Them not being able to enter the US' collective cognition because it is not the same as Japan's. And if they were able to enter it, how would Morgana be able to transform? The US doesn't share the same cognition of cats turning into buses as that is not as popular.

I think you've jumped over the point of how they would enter the Metaverse from Hawaii in the first place. They don't have any keywords for anyone living there.

I think you've jumped over the point of how they would enter the Metaverse from Hawaii in the first place. They don't have any keywords for anyone living there. That would be true if we didn't have Mementos in Shibuya. If I remember correctly Morgana led them there without the use of keywords. Otherwise yeah they wouldn't have been able to enter the Metaverse there.

I like your explanation and it's similar to how I've always viewed Mementos, but it raises on contradiction later on: in that erasing the Tokyo Mementos was stated as erasing the Metaverse. And they flat out say as such, that never again can they use it. So either Morgana and them never considered others or it was supposed to be wholly Japan. I honestly liked the concept of Mementos a lot more as the entire planet's cognition. From what other people have told me, P5 was originally going to be travel heavy, but they had to scale it back to just Japan, so no doubt, that was the original intent.

Interesting point, and as much as I am inclined to agree, I find it much more fun debating and playing Devils advocate. To that end: i think there are a few options here, but I'll try to limit it to only two. First off, it's entirely possible that mementos is used as a game board between differing deities and since this game has now come to an end, they, for lack of a better phrase, have put away the Metaverse until the next game in that region, and going with this, the differing games between deities could be using different Metaverses in different regions. Thus explaining how the Metaverse exists in multiple games. (If it does exist on the other Persona games) Now do I believe this? Not a chance. But it's an interesting take I find. This second one I believe more. Second off, it could be that since differing versions of similar deities can be found throughout the world, differing versions of Yaldabaoth could exist in differing Mementos across the worlds, each the core of their respective Mementos, but taking one out would erase them all as they aren't differing beings, but differing versions of the same God. Think of this like the movie Cabin in the Woods. I don't want to spoil that so I'll leave it be. So essential beating one destroys all Mementos, shutting down the Metaverse.

I would just like to point out that it is implied that Mementos was created (or at least discovered) around 2-3 years before the events of Persona 5. If Mementos is a 'game board' like you suspect, then surely the other deities that tried to mess with humanity use it as well. This is the first time in Persona where Mementos has been 'used', bare in mind that the Shadow World still exists in P5, even if it isn't mentioned.

Yeah well like I said, that's the one I believe less in, because that would require knowledge outside of Persona 5 to support, but sadly that's my limit until I can play the others on my computer. But since I love fighting uphill, I give you, my rebuttal: Welp I really only have one point and it isn't very strong. Perhaps it's just another type of board? If you wanted to beat your friends at a game, would you only play him in one game and one game alone? Or would you play against them in various ways to prove that you are better in those as well? Sure they share the same concepts, but the "board" that the gods play on varies from game to game. There's the Shadow World in P4, Mementos in P5 and I'm pretty sure there's a different one for P1-3.

Each Mementos essentially having its own core/boss makes enough sense for me. Different nationalities would have different core beliefs afterall, so while it might be the same god at the end, they will be different regardless. The same as how humanity has always drawn 'dragons', despite the actual designs of such varying greatly across the globe, the actual concept of giant fire breathing reptiles still existed across the board.

If you wanted to beat your friends at a game, would you only play him in one game and one game alone? Or would you play against them in various ways to prove that you are better in those as well? You say it like they're not essentially the same thing. For example: the Metaverse and the Shadow World (along with their physical counterparts, Palaces and the Midnight Channel) Are almost identical things, they're not wildly different things, like playing different board games.

I can't comment on what was setup in past Persona games. I never played them. I'm just going on P5 alone.

The same as how humanity has always drawn 'dragons', despite the actual designs of such varying greatly across the globe, the actual concept of giant fire breathing reptiles still existed across the board. My point exactly. What happens when you defeat one version of that concept? You defeat that version alone. (The Holy Grail form in Mementos.) But once you defeat the core, what all other versions were based on, you've basically erased a whole concept. (Beating Yaldabaoth in his Angel form.) As for the board games, I really don't know the others well enough to defend this line of thinking, so I rest my case in pieces.

When you think about it like that, It's honestly pretty scary. Although, Jaldaboath did say he had the power to enslave all of humanity and the Phantom Thieves did get famous worldwide before forgetting about them, perhaps it was only a single 'instance' of Jaldaboath.